I began to learn automobile mechanics as a teenager. It seems that it was simpler in that I could learn the basics from reading hobby magazines and you could repair things with a few hand tools. For the longest time I had nothing but a set of box end wrenches a pair of pliers and a couple of screw drivers. And I could change engines if I wanted to.
I don't know what it must be like now. The complexity is orders of magnitude harder. Electronics! Cars I learned on did not have radio's or turn signals. A horn was about it.
And then there seem to be a general consensus that everything has to be easy. It never was and has not gotten easier, just harder.
And no sense in looking up something in book, ask some one on the internet. A classic case in many ways of the blind leading the blind.
Being able to play a video game has no comparison to fixing your brakes despite both of them use a computer.
I can understand some one needing to repair their own car at the expense it costs these days. I can not understand some one taking offense at the suggestion that they at least buy a Chiltons or equivalent manual at the autoparts store that gives pictures and step by step procedures.
It is too expensive it is said.
And it is generally emphasized by some one who frankly has no skills at all nor the knowledge to know what the terms are and what they mean.
Go figure.

 

Unc......thats the reason I stopped trying to help 90% of those that post looking for help. They have no idea what they are asking, or how to fix it if you gave them step by step with pictures.

 

As great as this Forum site is, it's not geared to reproducing whole sections of a repair manual. Hit the high spots, and direct the questioner to the proper manual seems the most efficient method - - - am I wrong ??

 

No, not wrong, nor should the forum try to deal with reproducing information available in books that are accessible.

On the other hand, some people are truly clueless. If for example their idea of car repair is to install a stereo "System" purchased as a pre-packaged plug and play thing or bolting on a fresh air tube which is still as far as I am concerned more hype than function and are suddenly faced with the reality (yes reality! It is not a T.V. program with hidden camera man where something is done with a hidden staff of 30 people and a $50,000.00 budget and a 30 min. time window) of actually having to make a repair and have not got a clue how to go about doing it. A bit of hand holding is not a bad thing.
We all have been there some time in our lives and I can actually remember times I royally screwed things up due to well intentioned ignorance.
Pulling a half shaft is not a complex technical job for example, and replacing it with a rebuilt part is something that can be done by a person with rudimentary mechanical skills and a few basic hand tools and can be done in a parking space on a street. All due because a CV joint has gone out.
Is not something that is easily explained in this type of format. And it is also as a member difficult to ascertain the mechanical skills of some one asking a question about it, although there are clues one can recognize.
There are basics.
Some one who buys a 15 year old beater does not run to the dealer to get it fixed.
They are not programed to do that.
It might be above there mechanical ability to actually perform the repair due to location and lack of tools, but can understand the basics around doing so and being RECEPTIVE to the suggestion that they budget $30.00 to buy a Chiltons or what ever manual.
There are errors that take place on both sides.
I don't think the stock answer of go to a dealer is an appropriate answer for two reasons. It is not the mindset of some one buying a beater and most importantly there are no dealers.
How do you go to one if there is non to go to? And the answer needs to be logical no matter how many times it is repeated.
I go to dealers when I think it is the only alternative. But the last Saturn dealer I went to before they disappeared was way less than a satisfactory trip.
No it is not easy on this format to help people on out of production automobiles when they want a simple answer. Especially when there is no simple answers.
Just like all parts counter people are not incompetent nor all all auto parts outlets either good or bad but some are one or the other and many are just there.
I used to go out of my way to go to a well run CARQUEST store. An O'Rileys is closer and I have discovered better than half their counter people are unusually good. it has not always been that way but it is now. There is a young girl that can find almost anything. Where she got the knowledge, don't know. Don't care. I know if I am looking for something odd with a partial description based on ignorance, she will find one.

Saturns have become beaters due to attrition. If they become collectable it will be because of forums like this one continuing to be the information re-source center for them and as time passes broad based knowledge will be come selective and based on individual ownership of their particular model. Much of which will have a very narrow application due to multiple models and the variations of them as to where they were produced and sold and whether parts are going to be available to some one and what they will fit.
Passing on the information is going to get more difficult and the person who is not going to understand the reasons behind complexity is going to become more of a norm. And there are a lot of them now.
There is no obvious answer for that problem and a thick skin probably is going to be universally needed.

 

No Ocean your not wrong. Unc fact is there are dealers, and if the average Joe is going to have work done on a "SATURN" by the corner garage in most cases they would be better off to take it to the dealer. Why because most corner garages have never worked on a Saturn not to mention they don't have a scan tool to read what's going on with a Saturn. They have however been working on Fords and Chevy's etc and know most all they need to know. As far as parts go for 1991-2002 Saturn's "most" are inferior and that's if the guy behind the counter even looks up the correct model. I'd have no problem telling someone to take their Mopar to Al's Auto & Appliance Repair. Saturn's are another story all together.
Then what about Mr. One time poster that comes on with a host of problems and wants a one word answer as to what will fix it. We have had a number of people ask about things. You can tell after reading a few words they know what thy are talking about and are capable of understanding an answer as well as doing the repair. It's the rest of them that many of us have given up on.

 

I am new to this forum and new to saturns as well and wanted to say I do appreciate any and all help I get. I also worked on cars back before fuel injection and I have a little trouble with all this computer control stuff. But I figure either I will learn how to work on it or I will become friends with somebody who going to charge me a lot of money to fix something that takes five minutes to fix.

 

All of you make some good points. I just help those that seem to be able to help themselves.

 

O.K.,
I just bought my 15 year old 150,000 mile Saturn.
And it is suggested I take it to a dealer.
So I go to the following URL to find one.
http://www.edmunds.com/dealerships/Saturn/
and on this site is instructions as to how to find a dealer in my state
Find Local Car Dealers by State

With a chart to find the states and selecting Arizona where I live I look under the brand names, listed alphabetically for Saturn under S
Saab Car Dealer

Suzuki Car Dealer
Subaru Car Dealer
Smart Car Dealer
If taking the car to a dealer is a legitimate suggestion than there also should be a suggestion as how to go about finding one.

 

It's rather obvious there are no new car dealers flying the SATURN sign. Yet just like Oldsmobile, Pontiac, SAAB, Hummer a Saturn would go to GM dealer. It's not rocket science Unc.

Why in hell would anyone go to Edmunds to find a GM a dealer, a local GM dealer at that? Your making a mountain out of a mole hill.

PS: I think most every time take it to the dealer was brought up it was also suggested how to go about doing that. Such as: Take it to your local GM (Chevy) dealer authorized to work on Saturn's. I'm guess a person would know how to find GM dealers in his area and make a phone call. Here in the Phoenix Metro are there are a number of such dealerships.