Hi All - New here. I think I posted this in the wrong forum the first go around. Sorry if there is a double somewhere.

Here is my issue. This is a 2006 Ion with 170k miles on it. My daughter brought to my attention that in the last week, it is taking 3-4 cranks of the key to get it to start. Once started it runs fine. I notice if you shut it off when warm and start it right back up, it's fine. Let it sit for a few, and it takes a few turns of the key.

My original theory is that there is no fuel at the injectors after it sits. Perhaps a fuel pump issue.

Today I noticed a bit of a fuel smell towards the rear of the car. My daughter NOW tells me that this has been there since the starting problem began. I took a quick peak (it's dark) and did not see anything obvious leaking.

Are these issues likely related? Where should I look? I did see that there was a recall on the fuel pump in some states (not NJ of course) for a crack that develops.

Thanks for the help

Jeff

 

This got auto moderated by the forum software -- don't know if it was ever posted. It is now.....

Welcome to the forum.

It would seem like you are bleeding off fuel pressure between starts.

The easiest way to check this is to do a loan a tool from Autozone or similar for a fuel pressure gauge. Hook it up to the Schrader Valve test port in the fuel supply line under the hood (it's before or on the fuel rail (sorry, don't drive Ions)). Trace backwards from the fuel rail if needed to locate the valve.

Turning the key to RUN results in the PCM commanding the fuel pump relay to close, which runs the fuel pump for a few seconds (and then stop) to prime the fuel system to ensure there is adequate fuel pressure to start the vehicle.

Do the following on a COLD engine (at ambient temp, has not been driven or started or tried to start)

With fuel pressure gauge attached
1) Note fuel pressure reading
2) Turn the key to RUN but do NOT start the car
3) Watch the behavior of the fuel pressure gauge. It should rise quickly from wherever it was to a maximum value. Note the max value AND how long it took to get to that reading.
4) Turn the key to OFF.
5) Watch the behavior of the fuel pressure gauge. It should not move appreciably. Take a starting pressure reading and then a reading every 5 min for 30 min. I'm not sure what the spec is for your car (key ON /Engine OFF pressure and pressure decay as a function of time), but I'm sure an Ion owner or someone else on the forum has it handy or it can be found on the internet.

Repeat the entire test, being sure to note the initial pressure reading.

Take the pressure decay measurements as before.

Repeat test until the maximum fuel pressure is reached when turned to RUN and note that fuel pressure.

Try to start the car. Count how many tries it takes and note the fuel pressure while running.

What I believe is happening is that something is amiss in your fuel system and it is bleeding off pressure as a function of time and/or not permitting buildup to full pressure as fast as it could and should.

The car should start after the first prime and key turn, as the fuel pressure should be sufficient to star the car. When you turn the engine off. the pressure will bleed down a little as a function of time, but should not have a massive decline RIGHT AWAY.

I don't want to color the results, but I suspect it'll take 3 or 4 repetitions of the test above to arrive at a max fuel pressure with key on/engine off, and that the pressure buildup will be slow along the way. Also, when you turn the key to OFF, I believe you will see a significant drop in fuel pressure during that 30 minutes of monitoring.

Your ability to restart right away when the car is warm is because the fuel pressure is already built up and hasn't bled off yet.

Get back to us with the results and we'll take it from there.
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As far as the recall and smell of gas:

After the car has been driven AND COOLED down, place a piece of non flammable material under the entire gas tank (not under the trunk--you need to get down there and find the tank). If gas is leaking, you might see it on the material you laid down under the gas tank. You might not. It may just barely be leaking at the top of the tank, but we all know how strongly a little bit of gas smells. But point blank, you should not smell gas down there unless it is leaking from the top of the tank or your daughter spilled gas when fueling up or there is an issue with the evap emissions portion of the system, or you have a hole in the filler neck leading to the gas tank. So get a good directional idea of where the smell is coming from before your nose gets overwhelmed.

As far as the recall goes, did you buy the car new or used?
Do you know if there is a time or mileage limit for this recall/special coverage?

Oh damn I forgot about this

https://vinrcl.safercar.gov/vin/

lets you search by your VIN for open recalls. You car, if not purchased new, may have an open recall or special coverage extension for this because it met the criteria for the recall before you owned it.

Figuring who bought what where and registered it where sounds like a mess for GM; but I guess the gov't would have made them trace VINs to come up with the list of covered vehicles....

Good luck and report back

 

Crawled up underneath the car this morning. One of the lines between the fuel filter and the plastic keeper right before the heat wrap starts is rotted out. It's only a short piece of line that would need to be cut and replaced. The rest of it actually looks OK.

Better than a fuel pump crack, but still a pain to fix laying on your back. LOL I took it to my local mechanic. He normally is reasonable on these types of repairs.

 

yeah, that counts as "fuel system compromised all right. I think a leak in the line might bleed some pressure off......

So you smelled gas all the way at the back of the car? Must have been oozing quite a bit...

Glad you tracked it down